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	<title>Comments on: spiritual language</title>
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		<title>By: talking about spiritual experiences</title>
		<link>http://www.moritherapy.org/article/spiritual-language/comment-page-1/#comment-686784</link>
		<dc:creator>talking about spiritual experiences</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Jan 2010 07:19:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moritherapy.org/?p=1567#comment-686784</guid>
		<description>[...] a while ago evan asked the question how do we talk about our spiritual experience? we had a little discussion about that here. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] a while ago evan asked the question how do we talk about our spiritual experience? we had a little discussion about that here. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: isabella mori</title>
		<link>http://www.moritherapy.org/article/spiritual-language/comment-page-1/#comment-674492</link>
		<dc:creator>isabella mori</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Nov 2009 03:14:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moritherapy.org/?p=1567#comment-674492</guid>
		<description>@marie, thanks for your thoughtful comment.  what arises for me as i read this is the question of community as a spiritual place, a sacred place.  in buddhism we have the concept of &quot;sangha&quot; (a buddhist community) as one of the &quot;three jewels&quot; (the other two being buddha and dharma, the latter being the buddhist teachings).  i guess the problem is that community consists of people, and people will almost invariably bring not only love, compassion and warmth but also competition, fears and judgment.  is being a solitary practitioner the answer?  hard to say.

@mystic thanks for your comment!  what you said about words being subjective is so important.  if we could just always keep that in mind ...
.-= isabella mori&#180;s last blog ..&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.moritherapy.org/article/swans-on-a-wordless-wednesday/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;swans on a wordless wednesday&lt;/a&gt; =-.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@marie, thanks for your thoughtful comment.  what arises for me as i read this is the question of community as a spiritual place, a sacred place.  in buddhism we have the concept of &#8220;sangha&#8221; (a buddhist community) as one of the &#8220;three jewels&#8221; (the other two being buddha and dharma, the latter being the buddhist teachings).  i guess the problem is that community consists of people, and people will almost invariably bring not only love, compassion and warmth but also competition, fears and judgment.  is being a solitary practitioner the answer?  hard to say.</p>
<p>@mystic thanks for your comment!  what you said about words being subjective is so important.  if we could just always keep that in mind &#8230;<br />
<span class="cluv"> isabella mori&#180;s last blog ..<a href="http://www.moritherapy.org/article/swans-on-a-wordless-wednesday/" rel="nofollow">swans on a wordless wednesday</a> <span class="heart_tip_box"><img class="heart_tip" alt="My ComLuv Profile" border="0" width="16" height="14" src="http://moritherapy.org/wp-content/plugins/commentluv/images/littleheart.gif"/></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: mystic</title>
		<link>http://www.moritherapy.org/article/spiritual-language/comment-page-1/#comment-674342</link>
		<dc:creator>mystic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 13:48:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moritherapy.org/?p=1567#comment-674342</guid>
		<description>This is a really great post, I agree with all that you said Isabella, and Evan. I actually wrote a longer reply on my views in addressing the issue, but realised it was just the same as what you and all the others have said! 

Words/ labels are highly subjective and can be interpreted by people in many different ways, it is the experience which needs to be brought to the people, of spiritual upliftment.. then they can find their own ways of accessing this emotion in them once they experience it.. 

I keep a pen name as well, as the person who commented on marie&#039;s blog.. and the main reason is because I belong to a certain religion with followers who have rigid beliefs - and though I believe the beliefs are all true, it&#039;s just that some people see them with a very limited perspective, and anyone who steps out of the dominant thought pattern and sees them in a new Light, may be considered as deviant.. Thus I was in fear of being judged, mainly by people I know.

Glad I came across this post! Peace to all =)..
.-= mystic&#180;s last blog ..&lt;a href=&quot;http://blessedheart.wordpress.com/2009/09/08/remember/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Remember…&lt;/a&gt; =-.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a really great post, I agree with all that you said Isabella, and Evan. I actually wrote a longer reply on my views in addressing the issue, but realised it was just the same as what you and all the others have said! </p>
<p>Words/ labels are highly subjective and can be interpreted by people in many different ways, it is the experience which needs to be brought to the people, of spiritual upliftment.. then they can find their own ways of accessing this emotion in them once they experience it.. </p>
<p>I keep a pen name as well, as the person who commented on marie&#8217;s blog.. and the main reason is because I belong to a certain religion with followers who have rigid beliefs &#8211; and though I believe the beliefs are all true, it&#8217;s just that some people see them with a very limited perspective, and anyone who steps out of the dominant thought pattern and sees them in a new Light, may be considered as deviant.. Thus I was in fear of being judged, mainly by people I know.</p>
<p>Glad I came across this post! Peace to all =)..<br />
<span class="cluv"> mystic&#180;s last blog ..<a href="http://blessedheart.wordpress.com/2009/09/08/remember/" rel="nofollow">Remember…</a> <span class="heart_tip_box"><img class="heart_tip" alt="My ComLuv Profile" border="0" width="16" height="14" src="http://moritherapy.org/wp-content/plugins/commentluv/images/littleheart.gif"/></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: Marie</title>
		<link>http://www.moritherapy.org/article/spiritual-language/comment-page-1/#comment-673832</link>
		<dc:creator>Marie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Nov 2009 17:01:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moritherapy.org/?p=1567#comment-673832</guid>
		<description>Hi, Isabella -

I really like your last point -- that, often, our uncomfortable-ness about speaking about religion and spirituality comes from the fact we are afraid of being judged.  Maybe this is the crux of the difference in religion and spirituality . . . 

Let me borrow from something I wrote in response to a comment left on my blog:

&quot;For me, I believe that religion is more about a group of people bringing their beliefs in alignment with each others&#039; and with some instrument of record (like the Bible) – it seems to be more about the community.  I believe that spirituality is more about the unique experience of the individual – something that is more private.

&quot;I would have to say that, in childhood, I was dogmatically religious.  Then, when I entered adulthood, I moved away from that and became more spiritually aware – I defined (and am still defining) my concept of and relationship with my higher power – and it is something I do in private . . . and it often involves studying the path others have taken while on the same type of journey.

&quot;In this quest, I don&#039;t feel like I have to justify or bring my beliefs in alignment with anyone else&#039;s beliefs – I feel like it is between only me and my higher power.&quot;

So . . . I&#039;m wondering . . . if I feel fear of being judged (by others or by myself), is it because I am not yet confident of the validity of my own belief system and feel it will not stand up to the scrutiny of others.  In other words, if I am confident in my own belief system, I will likely not care if others agree with me or not.  (Spirituality)

However, if I feel pressure to conform to the belief system of a community, then it is reasonable to fear judgment from the members of that community.  It becomes about how well I fit into the community rather than how confident I am in my own belief system. (Religion)

Maybe it serves me well to only look to myself and to my higher power for approval.  And, in that context, I do not need to concern myself about the alignment of others&#039; beliefs with mine because it is none of my business – which makes it easier for me to listen with an open mind as others speak of their beliefs.  I can have an open mind because I have no reason to judge the other person&#039;s beliefs as &quot;in alignment&quot; or &quot;out of alignment&quot; with mine, and no reason to pressure the other person to change his or her beliefs.

So . . . there is my two cents worth . . . LOL

- Marie (Coming Out of the Trees)
.-= Marie&#180;s last blog ..&lt;a href=&quot;http://mmaaggnnaa.wordpress.com/2009/11/02/reader-input-7/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Reader Input: Trigger warnings&lt;/a&gt; =-.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi, Isabella -</p>
<p>I really like your last point &#8212; that, often, our uncomfortable-ness about speaking about religion and spirituality comes from the fact we are afraid of being judged.  Maybe this is the crux of the difference in religion and spirituality . . . </p>
<p>Let me borrow from something I wrote in response to a comment left on my blog:</p>
<p>&#8220;For me, I believe that religion is more about a group of people bringing their beliefs in alignment with each others&#8217; and with some instrument of record (like the Bible) – it seems to be more about the community.  I believe that spirituality is more about the unique experience of the individual – something that is more private.</p>
<p>&#8220;I would have to say that, in childhood, I was dogmatically religious.  Then, when I entered adulthood, I moved away from that and became more spiritually aware – I defined (and am still defining) my concept of and relationship with my higher power – and it is something I do in private . . . and it often involves studying the path others have taken while on the same type of journey.</p>
<p>&#8220;In this quest, I don&#8217;t feel like I have to justify or bring my beliefs in alignment with anyone else&#8217;s beliefs – I feel like it is between only me and my higher power.&#8221;</p>
<p>So . . . I&#8217;m wondering . . . if I feel fear of being judged (by others or by myself), is it because I am not yet confident of the validity of my own belief system and feel it will not stand up to the scrutiny of others.  In other words, if I am confident in my own belief system, I will likely not care if others agree with me or not.  (Spirituality)</p>
<p>However, if I feel pressure to conform to the belief system of a community, then it is reasonable to fear judgment from the members of that community.  It becomes about how well I fit into the community rather than how confident I am in my own belief system. (Religion)</p>
<p>Maybe it serves me well to only look to myself and to my higher power for approval.  And, in that context, I do not need to concern myself about the alignment of others&#8217; beliefs with mine because it is none of my business – which makes it easier for me to listen with an open mind as others speak of their beliefs.  I can have an open mind because I have no reason to judge the other person&#8217;s beliefs as &#8220;in alignment&#8221; or &#8220;out of alignment&#8221; with mine, and no reason to pressure the other person to change his or her beliefs.</p>
<p>So . . . there is my two cents worth . . . LOL</p>
<p>- Marie (Coming Out of the Trees)<br />
<span class="cluv"> Marie&#180;s last blog ..<a href="http://mmaaggnnaa.wordpress.com/2009/11/02/reader-input-7/" rel="nofollow">Reader Input: Trigger warnings</a> <span class="heart_tip_box"><img class="heart_tip" alt="My ComLuv Profile" border="0" width="16" height="14" src="http://moritherapy.org/wp-content/plugins/commentluv/images/littleheart.gif"/></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: Tweets that mention spiritual language -- Topsy.com</title>
		<link>http://www.moritherapy.org/article/spiritual-language/comment-page-1/#comment-673149</link>
		<dc:creator>Tweets that mention spiritual language -- Topsy.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 31 Oct 2009 15:04:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moritherapy.org/?p=1567#comment-673149</guid>
		<description>[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by isabella mori and Serenity Satoru, Y Grantham @4uqi. Y Grantham @4uqi said: spiritual language: a while ago we talked about the lack of scripts for talking about mental illness (at le.. http://bit.ly/TKgKo [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by isabella mori and Serenity Satoru, Y Grantham @4uqi. Y Grantham @4uqi said: spiritual language: a while ago we talked about the lack of scripts for talking about mental illness (at le.. <a href="http://bit.ly/TKgKo" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/TKgKo</a> [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Evan</title>
		<link>http://www.moritherapy.org/article/spiritual-language/comment-page-1/#comment-673066</link>
		<dc:creator>Evan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 31 Oct 2009 07:03:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moritherapy.org/?p=1567#comment-673066</guid>
		<description>Hi Isabella,

I&#039;ll be interested to see what other people have to say.
.-= Evan&#180;s last blog ..&lt;a href=&quot;http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/Wellbeingandhealthnet/~3/rm2iAo29QTw/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Helping Breast Cancer Research&lt;/a&gt; =-.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Isabella,</p>
<p>I&#8217;ll be interested to see what other people have to say.<br />
<span class="cluv"> Evan&#180;s last blog ..<a href="http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/Wellbeingandhealthnet/~3/rm2iAo29QTw/" rel="nofollow">Helping Breast Cancer Research</a> <span class="heart_tip_box"><img class="heart_tip" alt="My ComLuv Profile" border="0" width="16" height="14" src="http://moritherapy.org/wp-content/plugins/commentluv/images/littleheart.gif"/></span></span></p>
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