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	<title>Comments on: how christian churches respond to people with mental illness</title>
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		<title>By: Rudolf</title>
		<link>http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/comment-page-1/#comment-742190</link>
		<dc:creator>Rudolf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jul 2010 04:03:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/#comment-742190</guid>
		<description>One cannot apologize for religious elites.

Some businesses now must, or do, for some new workplace rules or to appear inclusive, hire people with disabilities. This is not without its problems. An aquaintance of mine recently told me that the customers at the McDonald&#039;s where she works, complained to management, that she talks to herself on the job. I suspect they had a word with her. I suggested to her that many people appear to be talking to themselves when they are actually talking to someone on the phone, with hidden microphones and earphones. To me at least, they seem quite ritarded, proudly walking down the street or sitting on the bus, mouthing off to the air.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One cannot apologize for religious elites.</p>
<p>Some businesses now must, or do, for some new workplace rules or to appear inclusive, hire people with disabilities. This is not without its problems. An aquaintance of mine recently told me that the customers at the McDonald&#8217;s where she works, complained to management, that she talks to herself on the job. I suspect they had a word with her. I suggested to her that many people appear to be talking to themselves when they are actually talking to someone on the phone, with hidden microphones and earphones. To me at least, they seem quite ritarded, proudly walking down the street or sitting on the bus, mouthing off to the air.</p>
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		<title>By: Amitola</title>
		<link>http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/comment-page-1/#comment-742062</link>
		<dc:creator>Amitola</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jun 2010 21:43:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/#comment-742062</guid>
		<description>i was ignored by my pastor and the elders and various church members when they found out i had a mental illness</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i was ignored by my pastor and the elders and various church members when they found out i had a mental illness</p>
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		<title>By: Beverly Vaugh</title>
		<link>http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/comment-page-1/#comment-677311</link>
		<dc:creator>Beverly Vaugh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Nov 2009 19:36:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/#comment-677311</guid>
		<description>Hello Everyone, I just want to address that we all live in a fallen world and to try to explain dis-eases of the mind, body or spirit can be complexed; if we try to understand it from a world view.  Because we all have a creator, God who is spirit, that is part of our make up. I believe that God can and will heal that is part of his nature but I also believe some need medication. ( God does not need doctors, doctors need God.) I am interested in this discussion because I have family members who have been diagnosed with bi-polar, schzophrenia... Many of my family members claim Christianity and I believe would not be doing as well as they are without prayer to the almighty God.  My niece, who is a social worker and I are both members of a Christian church and was just talking about how the &quot;church&quot; handles mental illness. God sent his son, Jesus Christ to die for relationship not religion. I believe when one accepts that we are all sinners and we have all rebelled against a holy God, that is the starting point of becoming whole, mind body and spirit. (whether you have been diagnosed with a mental illness or not.)  I do believe in divine healing but would never suggest someone not go to a doctors, take their meds... But I would suggest whatever the case take responbility of knowing what the purpose of the meds are for, know the side effects.  My neice who was diagnosed with bipolar in her early teens, and she  started fairing better in life because she understood she needs to manage her own life by being responsible in 1)understanding the dis-ease and 2)taking her meds 3)she believes in divine healing.  Until next time, may God delivers us all from our ways of thinking that moves us so far away from him.  I apologize for the religious elites who think they know God and don&#039;t need to love in word and deed all, whether mental ill or not.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello Everyone, I just want to address that we all live in a fallen world and to try to explain dis-eases of the mind, body or spirit can be complexed; if we try to understand it from a world view.  Because we all have a creator, God who is spirit, that is part of our make up. I believe that God can and will heal that is part of his nature but I also believe some need medication. ( God does not need doctors, doctors need God.) I am interested in this discussion because I have family members who have been diagnosed with bi-polar, schzophrenia&#8230; Many of my family members claim Christianity and I believe would not be doing as well as they are without prayer to the almighty God.  My niece, who is a social worker and I are both members of a Christian church and was just talking about how the &#8220;church&#8221; handles mental illness. God sent his son, Jesus Christ to die for relationship not religion. I believe when one accepts that we are all sinners and we have all rebelled against a holy God, that is the starting point of becoming whole, mind body and spirit. (whether you have been diagnosed with a mental illness or not.)  I do believe in divine healing but would never suggest someone not go to a doctors, take their meds&#8230; But I would suggest whatever the case take responbility of knowing what the purpose of the meds are for, know the side effects.  My neice who was diagnosed with bipolar in her early teens, and she  started fairing better in life because she understood she needs to manage her own life by being responsible in 1)understanding the dis-ease and 2)taking her meds 3)she believes in divine healing.  Until next time, may God delivers us all from our ways of thinking that moves us so far away from him.  I apologize for the religious elites who think they know God and don&#8217;t need to love in word and deed all, whether mental ill or not.</p>
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		<title>By: John</title>
		<link>http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/comment-page-1/#comment-670119</link>
		<dc:creator>John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Oct 2009 01:42:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/#comment-670119</guid>
		<description>I find this discussion interesting as I am seeking to write a book from a Christians perspective on  depression. The church has always had fringe groups- as do all groups. Historically, many great Christian leaders have struggled with the dark night of the soul. On this list you will find CS Lewis, Spurgeon, Luther, Lincoln, and even the apostle Paul. For an insightful Christian perspective, see Spurgeon&#039;s Lecture to My Student. The ministers fainting fits.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I find this discussion interesting as I am seeking to write a book from a Christians perspective on  depression. The church has always had fringe groups- as do all groups. Historically, many great Christian leaders have struggled with the dark night of the soul. On this list you will find CS Lewis, Spurgeon, Luther, Lincoln, and even the apostle Paul. For an insightful Christian perspective, see Spurgeon&#8217;s Lecture to My Student. The ministers fainting fits.</p>
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		<title>By: Jeremy Lim</title>
		<link>http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/comment-page-1/#comment-553956</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeremy Lim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Oct 2008 02:27:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/#comment-553956</guid>
		<description>... I could go on forever about this.  I come from a Catholic background, and I still practice regularly.  I&#039;m also very familiar with depression.  

While it doesn&#039;t apply to everyone, it&#039;s very true that people see suffering as a sign divine of punishment - or something.  I can&#039;t stand how some religious folks are so elitist.  Once, walking through a mall in Singapore, I was told by an Evangelist I was going to hell because I was Catholic.  I can&#039;t imagine what they would have said to someone from a religion not cut from the same fabric.

It&#039;s disgusting.  Really. 

Sad thing is, I don&#039;t know if there&#039;s a solution.  We learn by the trials we go through.  Acceptance comes from experience, but I dare not wish depression on the world.

Jeremy
&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.outcome3.com&quot; title=&quot;Vancouver Search Engine Optimization and Internet Marketing&quot;&gt;Outcome3 Vancouver Internet Marketing&lt;/a&gt;

&lt;em&gt;Jeremy Lim&#039;s last blog post..&lt;a href=&#039;http://feeds.feedburner.com/~r/jeremylim/~3/423051823/marketing-on-facebook-with-groups-or-pages&#039;&gt;Marketing on Facebook with Groups or Pages?  Day-job Jeremy tells the tale!&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/em&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230; I could go on forever about this.  I come from a Catholic background, and I still practice regularly.  I&#8217;m also very familiar with depression.  </p>
<p>While it doesn&#8217;t apply to everyone, it&#8217;s very true that people see suffering as a sign divine of punishment &#8211; or something.  I can&#8217;t stand how some religious folks are so elitist.  Once, walking through a mall in Singapore, I was told by an Evangelist I was going to hell because I was Catholic.  I can&#8217;t imagine what they would have said to someone from a religion not cut from the same fabric.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s disgusting.  Really. </p>
<p>Sad thing is, I don&#8217;t know if there&#8217;s a solution.  We learn by the trials we go through.  Acceptance comes from experience, but I dare not wish depression on the world.</p>
<p>Jeremy<br />
<a href="http://www.outcome3.com" title="Vancouver Search Engine Optimization and Internet Marketing">Outcome3 Vancouver Internet Marketing</a></p>
<p><em>Jeremy Lim&#8217;s last blog post..<a href='http://feeds.feedburner.com/~r/jeremylim/~3/423051823/marketing-on-facebook-with-groups-or-pages'>Marketing on Facebook with Groups or Pages?  Day-job Jeremy tells the tale!</a></em></p>
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		<title>By: Rudolf</title>
		<link>http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/comment-page-1/#comment-524401</link>
		<dc:creator>Rudolf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Aug 2008 06:21:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/#comment-524401</guid>
		<description>Visiting a secular place is no guarantee of a safe haven for persons who are sometimes mentally ill. Secular people are no better than Christians or other religious people for taking up the cross and helping out or being nice to the weird-at-heart. There are many agendae and great posturing in the regular run-of-the-mill life. Phoniness and established hierarchies are at least if not more prevalent in the everyday world, and harmful in many ways.

It takes a pretty gifted person to deal with someone who is suffering in this way. People generally don&#039;t have the patience. The point is that some people in mental difficulty can be set off more easily, can react more quickly. At first others may not know that problems may arise from their engaging in normal everyday verbal abuse. And soon after it may be too late.

It seems to be difficult for almost anyone to be completely impartial and fair to persons with a psychiatric problem. We cannot expect this from everyone. We have to try to understand the insanity of normal. By grasping how important it is for some to be considered normal and to do all this requires may help us forgive the mean-in-the-moment person. One reason to present as normal is to have a job. If you veer off a bit, you may not have that job for long. We have to be thankful that quite a large number of people are at least trying to understand, and succeeding in doing so.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Visiting a secular place is no guarantee of a safe haven for persons who are sometimes mentally ill. Secular people are no better than Christians or other religious people for taking up the cross and helping out or being nice to the weird-at-heart. There are many agendae and great posturing in the regular run-of-the-mill life. Phoniness and established hierarchies are at least if not more prevalent in the everyday world, and harmful in many ways.</p>
<p>It takes a pretty gifted person to deal with someone who is suffering in this way. People generally don&#8217;t have the patience. The point is that some people in mental difficulty can be set off more easily, can react more quickly. At first others may not know that problems may arise from their engaging in normal everyday verbal abuse. And soon after it may be too late.</p>
<p>It seems to be difficult for almost anyone to be completely impartial and fair to persons with a psychiatric problem. We cannot expect this from everyone. We have to try to understand the insanity of normal. By grasping how important it is for some to be considered normal and to do all this requires may help us forgive the mean-in-the-moment person. One reason to present as normal is to have a job. If you veer off a bit, you may not have that job for long. We have to be thankful that quite a large number of people are at least trying to understand, and succeeding in doing so.</p>
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		<title>By: isabella mori</title>
		<link>http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/comment-page-1/#comment-517245</link>
		<dc:creator>isabella mori</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Aug 2008 22:04:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/#comment-517245</guid>
		<description>CC, thanks for stirring the pot!  i will go and visit godlinked, and will also tell marja about it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>CC, thanks for stirring the pot!  i will go and visit godlinked, and will also tell marja about it.</p>
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		<title>By: ClinicallyClueless</title>
		<link>http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/comment-page-1/#comment-516905</link>
		<dc:creator>ClinicallyClueless</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Aug 2008 12:34:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/#comment-516905</guid>
		<description>This is the reason that I decided to remain at Godlinked.com which is like a Christian MySpace.  It has been difficult because, especially at the beginning, I was told all sorts of things like the above including that I did not belong there.  It is so disheartening that the Christian church can be so judgemental, yet secular places can be so accepting.  It isn&#039;t supposed to be that way.  Anyway, everyweek at Godlinked, I post an article, video or something about mental illness and started a group there for those effected by mental illness.  I now have 9 members yea!! But, my goal is to continually remind them that mental illness is real and will not go away.  I know I&#039;m stirring the pot...But, I am not going to be quiet and go away...as was suggested.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is the reason that I decided to remain at Godlinked.com which is like a Christian MySpace.  It has been difficult because, especially at the beginning, I was told all sorts of things like the above including that I did not belong there.  It is so disheartening that the Christian church can be so judgemental, yet secular places can be so accepting.  It isn&#8217;t supposed to be that way.  Anyway, everyweek at Godlinked, I post an article, video or something about mental illness and started a group there for those effected by mental illness.  I now have 9 members yea!! But, my goal is to continually remind them that mental illness is real and will not go away.  I know I&#8217;m stirring the pot&#8230;But, I am not going to be quiet and go away&#8230;as was suggested.</p>
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		<title>By: isabella mori</title>
		<link>http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/comment-page-1/#comment-437094</link>
		<dc:creator>isabella mori</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 13:51:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/#comment-437094</guid>
		<description>barry, thanks for this great comment.  my reply is in a new blog post, &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.moritherapy.org/article/mental-illness-stigma-in-churches-an-occasion-for-self-reflection/&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>barry, thanks for this great comment.  my reply is in a new blog post, <a href="http://www.moritherapy.org/article/mental-illness-stigma-in-churches-an-occasion-for-self-reflection/">here</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: Barry K</title>
		<link>http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/comment-page-1/#comment-435129</link>
		<dc:creator>Barry K</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Apr 2008 20:56:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moritherapy.org/article/how-christian-churches-respond-to-people-with-mental-illness/#comment-435129</guid>
		<description>I was diagnosed with a schizophrenic related illness 6 years back and I can testify to the appalling and ignorant prejudice, of some (note: not all) churches concerned with the alleged propagation/propaganda of &#039;Christian Love&#039;.

I lost my job, my friends (Christian and otherwise in fairness) and almost all hope, as it slowly dawned on me, that some of my former fellowship brethren, having taken holy orders, were quite prepared to spurn me and still consider themselves sanctified of Christ for so doing. 

Let me give y0u some further evidence of the church mentality in this difficult area of medical science. I&#039;ve suffered with simple depression (as an acomplice to the more recent diagnosis ) for 28 years and during 1995/96, I allowed a group of Chrismatic christians to convince me that I was being oppressed by an entire hierarchy of evil spirits, from which they proceeded to conduct a series of fully-fledged Exorcisms. I have never felt so frightened in my life and once I&#039;d left that region, I asumed I&#039;d put it all behind me, but I was wrong. The moment you mention mental troubles to the evangelical/charismatic christian spectrum they tend (not in every case) to talk of scripture in a pronouncedly denouncing manner. There are several reasons for this

1) They&#039;re comfortable with their critical views and change means humility and hard work

2) They think that they can heal ANY illness by imnmediate prayer (and if the person concerned isn&#039;t immediately healed, they become very worried that their prayers have failed, thus passing same on/back to sufferer, with the inevitable &#039;your faith wasn&#039;t strong enough&#039; or &#039;you weren&#039;t co-operating with prayer&#039; - anything to avoid facing the terrible and ashen fact that God , for whatever reason, has said NO to them, which he&#039;s entitled to do after all).

3) They can&#039;t bear to think of themselves (or their children) suffering such intractability and so they respond with judgemental attitudes driven by fear and apparent need to placate the Almighty

It&#039;s important to state that this isn&#039;t every christian you encounter on this subject, but it&#039;s a worrying percentage of the avant-garde Pentecostal faith. The Catholics (God bless them),  seem much more tolerant, as do the Anglicans and even the Methodists. 

I became a Christian in Mrch of 1994 at a provincial Baptist church in Britain but was ultimately forced to flee worshipped profession of my faith, in favour of a quiet and personally experienced work with the Lord (for which some in the church accuse me of heresy), but I remind them of Jesus and the thief on the Cross , as it&#039;s a salutory story that silences them completely

Another thing that irritates them greatly is the fact that they profess great comprehension of the Bible (and in many cases that&#039;s true) but I went and obtained a post graduate degree in a theological discipline, thus inviting the question in their minds, how can an alleged madman have sufficient gravitas to gain a recognised qualification? (which makes them feel shallow)

The trick ( if indeed there is one) is to rebut ignorance with dignity and knowledge and when you&#039;re given judgemental opinions on your illness, to request the personally graduated medical school it came from. That eliminates 99% of them immediately. And when they bang on about knowing &#039;the best doctor of all in heaven&#039;, then ask them why you saw them in the drug store last week, with a script from their family physician

Yours in Christ

Barry</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was diagnosed with a schizophrenic related illness 6 years back and I can testify to the appalling and ignorant prejudice, of some (note: not all) churches concerned with the alleged propagation/propaganda of &#8216;Christian Love&#8217;.</p>
<p>I lost my job, my friends (Christian and otherwise in fairness) and almost all hope, as it slowly dawned on me, that some of my former fellowship brethren, having taken holy orders, were quite prepared to spurn me and still consider themselves sanctified of Christ for so doing. </p>
<p>Let me give y0u some further evidence of the church mentality in this difficult area of medical science. I&#8217;ve suffered with simple depression (as an acomplice to the more recent diagnosis ) for 28 years and during 1995/96, I allowed a group of Chrismatic christians to convince me that I was being oppressed by an entire hierarchy of evil spirits, from which they proceeded to conduct a series of fully-fledged Exorcisms. I have never felt so frightened in my life and once I&#8217;d left that region, I asumed I&#8217;d put it all behind me, but I was wrong. The moment you mention mental troubles to the evangelical/charismatic christian spectrum they tend (not in every case) to talk of scripture in a pronouncedly denouncing manner. There are several reasons for this</p>
<p>1) They&#8217;re comfortable with their critical views and change means humility and hard work</p>
<p>2) They think that they can heal ANY illness by imnmediate prayer (and if the person concerned isn&#8217;t immediately healed, they become very worried that their prayers have failed, thus passing same on/back to sufferer, with the inevitable &#8216;your faith wasn&#8217;t strong enough&#8217; or &#8216;you weren&#8217;t co-operating with prayer&#8217; &#8211; anything to avoid facing the terrible and ashen fact that God , for whatever reason, has said NO to them, which he&#8217;s entitled to do after all).</p>
<p>3) They can&#8217;t bear to think of themselves (or their children) suffering such intractability and so they respond with judgemental attitudes driven by fear and apparent need to placate the Almighty</p>
<p>It&#8217;s important to state that this isn&#8217;t every christian you encounter on this subject, but it&#8217;s a worrying percentage of the avant-garde Pentecostal faith. The Catholics (God bless them),  seem much more tolerant, as do the Anglicans and even the Methodists. </p>
<p>I became a Christian in Mrch of 1994 at a provincial Baptist church in Britain but was ultimately forced to flee worshipped profession of my faith, in favour of a quiet and personally experienced work with the Lord (for which some in the church accuse me of heresy), but I remind them of Jesus and the thief on the Cross , as it&#8217;s a salutory story that silences them completely</p>
<p>Another thing that irritates them greatly is the fact that they profess great comprehension of the Bible (and in many cases that&#8217;s true) but I went and obtained a post graduate degree in a theological discipline, thus inviting the question in their minds, how can an alleged madman have sufficient gravitas to gain a recognised qualification? (which makes them feel shallow)</p>
<p>The trick ( if indeed there is one) is to rebut ignorance with dignity and knowledge and when you&#8217;re given judgemental opinions on your illness, to request the personally graduated medical school it came from. That eliminates 99% of them immediately. And when they bang on about knowing &#8216;the best doctor of all in heaven&#8217;, then ask them why you saw them in the drug store last week, with a script from their family physician</p>
<p>Yours in Christ</p>
<p>Barry</p>
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